Fast & Furious 6
The Hangover Part III
Inside Llewyn Davis
Oh, I know, we're not supposed to bother the beautiful minds of fanboys by pointing out the misogynist subtexts of their gorefests. It's just a movie, boys will be boys, etc and so on. Well, tough... someone has to tell them.
We are told many times.... to the point of watching movies like this as an outlet to the nagging.
May 14 - 11:59 AM
So, just so I'm clear. Being told that stuff you like denigrates the women you profess to be attracted to is "nagging."
Is the dehumanization of women a requirement for you to get turned on? Or is just a bonus?
May 14 - 02:34 PM
It's just a bonus for me. I watch the new Piranha films for the piranhas, Ving Rhames and Christopher Lloyd. If there's boobs to look at, even better!
May 14 - 03:39 PM
why do people find racial jokes funny? maybe because lots of people are racists? or maybe they like to poke fun at all the PC preaching. I go with the latter, and same goes for this. its funny cause it's wrong. Its on film, not real life.
May 14 - 09:05 PM
Movies like this pokes fun at the feminist movement. In the 70's there were many movies preaching about independent women (Coma, Norma Rae, anything with Jane Fonda). There is NOTHING wrong with that, it's common sense, so why are we being told repetitively? From that came out the slasher genre in the 80's. It's what happens when you go overboard, there will be blowback. You are not telling us anything new, it will make fanboys want see it more.
May 14 - 09:34 PM
what's 'denigrate' mean? is that related to boobs or sex?
May 21 - 09:30 AM
Jun 1 - 09:32 AM
Sort of like the sweeping misandry (sic) of lumping in all "fanboys" and men as chauvanistic douchebags for no other reason than the fact that they're men? Hmm. I've met a lot of strong, balanced and admirable woman in my short span on this earth but suffice to say you do not strike me as one of them.
May 21 - 11:48 AM
Ah, yes. The SWEEPING misandry. /sarcasm
May 25 - 03:19 PM
Awesome as well!
Jun 1 - 09:34 AM
Mary, you need to stick with flicks like "How to Make An American Quilt"-stuff like that-horro movies about piranhas are supposed to be bloody and funny-thats it-dont look for anythign deeper-it aint there and the fans dont care...
May 21 - 05:49 PM
The only people who are dehumanizing women are people like you who act like they are fragile, dependent creatures who cannot make up their own minds on whether or not to be in a fictional film.
May 25 - 12:09 AM
Don't pretend to understand how the male mind works.
May 29 - 12:53 PM
Oh fuck off.
May 16 - 10:04 AM
May 21 - 11:16 PM
yeah, agreed. just write your review; take your agenda elsewhere
May 25 - 06:49 AM
I didn't like it because the comedy missed the mark, it was missing the meaning and wit of the first film and overall it was just not much fun. But everyone has their reasons!
May 18 - 04:32 PM
FYI, us fans of the series are dissapointed with this crap. *sigh.
May 18 - 07:12 PM
Problem with this film:
Piranha 3D was a horror movie with comedic elements, which works perfectly with the genre.
Piranha 3DD is a comedy with little horror elements, which doesn't work.
Danielle Panabaker can only save what ever is salvaged from this movie, had they atleast cut the stupid cheesy crap music in the background, this movie might be a bit more descent. Conclusion:
Piranha 3DD = Scary Movie 5 .
May 18 - 07:15 PM
Look, I'm against people like Mary Ann Joahanson whining about the "dehumanization of women" at the hands of "misogynistic male audiences" in film, but movies like this really aren't helping my case.
But still, even if she's right about the movie being somewhat misogynistic, that still doesn't change the fact that she uses the term "fanboy" as a synonym for her loose caricature of the average male person, and that means that this review is completely negligible. Same goes for the Underworld: Awakening review, even if they are both terrible movies.
May 21 - 08:55 AM
On one hand, Johanson sends some criticism directly to the audience, which isn't really fair. An attack sent to every potentially interested viewer will be unwarranted to at least a few of them. (Plus, as a critic, it's really not wise to pick a fight with true "fanboys" even if you do cross them. They'll come back forever to get the last anonymous word and, if need be, just make up reasons why they're "right". And no, you won't become the crusader who struck a blow for your cause starting such an arguement.)
On the other hand, that does seem to be the appeal this movie is going for and, from the movie's end, that really is trash.
May 21 - 01:58 PM
Oh, no. Looks like Ms. Johanson struck a nerve.
May 21 - 06:04 PM
Keep ripping on fanboys...it will direct more traffic to your website.
May 21 - 09:39 PM
I'm not surprised by this. I didn't like the first one. Never thought the sequel will do better.
May 22 - 06:32 AM
This has been happening in 'slasher' movies since the 70's, and it's also just a movie, not real life. I think Ms. Johanson takes herself a bit too seriously
May 22 - 06:21 PM
How this film or any film like it has fans is beyond me.
May 24 - 01:06 PM
Ugh. I don't even want to see this movie, but I hate it when people say stuff like this. It's all in good fun! It's a harmless, if not incredibly stupid, movie.
May 24 - 06:43 PM
lol all the comments from men
May 25 - 04:40 PM
Jocimar Dias Jr.
By the very upset comments posted here, I can guess that this "agenda" should still be debated nowadays. If mass-murdering naked stripers in film is fun and pleasurable, and not mysogynistic punishment for women's sexuality, then we still have things to discuss here... No, it's not just entertainment, and yes, we can (and should) question the discourses that are behind it.
May 26 - 08:15 AM
I have never been in a fight, and I detest violence. The idea of owning a gun, or any other kind of lethal weapon sickens me. I am also very polite, and I have equal respect for both sexes (I typically prefer talking to women).
I like these kinds of movies. Does that make me a misogynist? A violent person?
May 27 - 11:42 PM
That would partly depend on what it is you like about them. It's a common psychological fallacy to convince oneself that positive personal behavior makes lesser negative personal behavior irrelevant.
May 30 - 08:58 AM
It's also a common fallacy to equate one's taste in movies to a specific set of traits. MaryAnn Johanson and Jocimar Dias J Are clearly under the impression that to some degree the people who watch this kind of stuff are morally bankrupt, anti-women, etc.
People like these kinds of movies, including women. I don't see why people should have to answer for what they happen to like. You don't know anything about me, yet you seem to be making an assumption that I have some sort of mental defect that causes me to like these kinds of movies.
Here's why I like these movies: They're funny, thrilling, or both. Gratuity is a great way to go about adding a level of irony to any scene. In Kill Bill (awful movie, but good example), when someone's head gets sliced off, blood shoots out like a geyser, which totally trivializes the seriousness of a decapitation and provides a tongue in cheek element that I appreciate in movies. When someone boxes Jason Voorhees, then he punches them once and their head launches hundreds of feet, then falls into a dumpster, it's so incredibly silly and unreal that I can enjoy it.
On the other hand, and movie like the original Halloween isn't over-the-top, but it does a good job of building up tension and keeping you on the edge of your seat. Instead of a comedy slasher where you wan Jason to come up with new and inventive ways to completely overkill everyone, in Halloween you're rooting for the potential victims. You want them to get away. You become invested in their characters. You're afraid for them. Effectively fleshing out likable characters and putting them in deadly situations isn't too unlike a roller coaster ride. It's that sense of danger that makes it exciting to watch.
Nudity is always nice. There's nothing more beautiful than a woman's body, and if a guy's stuff shows up on screen, I'm not going to make a fuss over it. I don't root for the blonde with the big breasts to get killed just because she showed some skin. If she does get killed, I'm not going to be thinking about the fact that she got naked. If she was an likable or interesting character, I'll be disappointed to see her dispatched. If she was hollow or cruel, I'll shrug it off.
As for this specific film, I have no interest in seeing it (despite loving the previous film in the series). I loathed the director's debut movie "Feast," and I knew this would get bad reviews. However, one thing I have trouble swallowing is that this is a "misogynistic" movie, because the most heroic characters in Feast were two women. They took charge and, with their leadership, the human cast managed to hold the monsters off and have a few survivors by the end of the movie.
Neo-feminists read a lot into EVERYTHING and come to the conclusion that men are trying to bring them down in every walk of life. If a video game has barbarians and the male barbarian has a leopard thong and the female has fur bikini, that's sexist because the reasons for the characters being stripped to what is essentially underwear are completely different. The male gaze, and all that. Sometimes there really isn't anything to these things. Just kick back and enjoy the movie or don't watch it if you're not interested. Sheesh.
May 31 - 02:25 PM
Starting from the top, if a movie is trying to appeal to such traits, it's not unwarranted assume at least some fans have those traits, though it may not be the case for you personally.
Now, though poor taste among audiences should be discouraged (self-aware material in which we're supposed to know that it's deliberatly bad taste is different), true, the audience should not have to answer for what they're being sold. As I commented before, my problem with Johanson is that she's directing her attack to the viewers, and there will always be some who don't deserve it, such as yourself from what you say. (Plus I'm also leery of the would-be feminists who think beating down men = building up women.) It's the people encouraging viewers to buy it who should be brought to task.
The examples you cited are all true, but it's also true that some movies (mainly the less innovative cash-grabs) are not exceptions to these criticisms. The remake of Texas Chainsaw Massacre (though it did manage to stage some tense scenarios), made the point of each chase to watch the victims get mutilated and die on screen. It didn't understand that, in and of itself, just watching someone feel pain or die isn't scary; it's sad. But it wanted its audience to see it as exciting and fun.
Nudity has it's place as well, such as the effect it added to Willow's song in the original Wicker Man. It can lend itself well to eroticism. But there's a reason people ussaully don't go naked in public, and if someone's bare on screen for no greater reason than the movie deciding it's what they're good for, it definitely doesn't discourage what feminists criticize in people.
Maybe you shouldn't have said "these kinds of movies". So far, Piranha 3DD just sounds like a turd.
May 31 - 05:17 PM
You have valid points. I'm sure there are plenty of those who watch these kinds of movies for what we would consider to be the wrong reasons. My problem, as is yours, is that she went after the viewers. She also said something about "fanboys." I don't think she knows what that means...
To me, a critic is just setting themselves up to be hated when they do this, because they are directly referring to random people who may be interested in the movie. It reminds me of a review I read for The Dark Knight in which the author, Armond White, basically calls people who enjoyed the movie morons. That review has 325 comments on it because people don't appreciate being spat on (his profile pic doesn't help).
Now picture Armond White calling people stupid for not just liking that movie, but liking superhero or action movies in general. That's basically what Johanson did here, only I think stupidity is a much better thing to suffer from than something as volatile as misogyny. I think she owes her readers an apology, or at the very least an edit of her rather ignorant vitriol.
On an unrelated note, I can't believe this thing's up to 20% right now. I'm guessing it'll drop back down into the teens (could we possibly see mid to high single digits?) once the rest of the reviews start flooding in.
May 31 - 07:21 PM
Oh, I think Armond White was hitting lower than that before he finished. Eventually it just became that anyone not an Armond White fan was a pitiful moron.
And yeah, Johanson comes across like she's trying to be the bold, opinionated crusader while making the mistake of picking an unwarranted (losing) fight.
May 31 - 08:17 PM
the movie is bad. battlefield earth bad.
May 27 - 01:58 PM
That's an insult to Battlefield Earth.
I never thought I'd ever say that.
May 27 - 05:58 PM
LOL!! i never thought i would hear it.
Jun 1 - 09:27 PM
I always find this argument interesting . I've been watching horror films of all shapes and sizes for over thirty years now and I have to tell you, there are always a lot of women in the audience, many times in a sizable group without any men in sight, often in their teens. This is particularly common at slasher films, a sub-genre of horror that is notorious for its misogynistic tendencies. Some of the most devoted horror fans I know are women.
Now I haven't seen Piranha 3DD yet and I doubt I will, but not because of any perceived misogyny. I'll skip it because, by all accounts, it's just not a good movie.
I will say,though,that I saw the previous film in a theatre and I loved it. That movie was gleefully exploitative and it winked at the audience the entire time. It can also be said that Jerry O'Connell is on the receiving end of the most brutal death in that flick. In fact,many of these films marked as having a hateful attitude towards women often reserve the nastiest demises for their male characters.
One thing I'm curious about: If hateful., dangerous attitudes towards women are the problem, why hasn't their been a more passionate outcry against Twilight, a movie with the message that teenage girls should put their self respect on hold and tolerate what amounts to psychologically abusive, stalker behavior from a boyfriend in the name of romance?
May 29 - 01:03 AM
But there HAS been a huge outcry against Twilight for that! It's just that it gets overshadowed by squealing teen fans who don't know any better or misogynists on the internet who look past the real problems with the story and just say "it sucks cos sparkling and feelings are gay."
May 29 - 01:36 AM
I did some research after you posted your reply and yep, you're right! My bad..I don't really follow anything Twilight connected that closely, so I actually missed that other people had called it out.
I still think the perceived misogyny in most of these films- particularly in the post 1998, self referentially ironic Scream era -is intentional. It plays more like self parody than anything else. Once we hit the era of female characters such as Elm Street's Nancy Thompson or ALIEN's Ellen Ripley, it became clear that audiences -fanboys included- have no issue with strong central female characters being the heroine of a major horror film.
May 29 - 08:19 PM
You'd think the title Piranha 3DD would've tipped her off. I'm going to be let down if the so-called "misogyny" (word used whenever sexy women are victims) is only hinted at. This is supposed to be an exploitation picture. If you want subtext, you're at the wrong drive-in. I'm expecting tits in my face.
May 29 - 08:30 AM
ROFL @ The fanboy butthurt.
You people are such phaggits
May 31 - 10:05 PM