Walter Murch on Youth Without Youth: The RT Interview (With Exclusive Photos and Clips!)
The legendary editor of Apocalypse Now and The English Patient talks Coppola's latest.
One of the most important and influential craftsmen of the "Movie Brat" generation that came of age in the 1970s, Murch has worked as a film and/or sound editor on such landmark films as American Graffiti, The Godfather Part II, The Conversation, Apocalypse Now, The Unbearable Lightness of Being, and The English Patient. Youth Without Youth is the latest in a long line of collaborations with Coppola; their professional relationship stretches back to 1969, when Murch handled the sound editing on The Rain People.
Murch remains one of the few editors to work standing up, comparing editing film to working as a surgeon or a short-order cook. But he's no stodgy traditionalist; Murch has been a champion of technological advances in editing, cutting Cold Mountain on Final Cut Pro at a time when AVID was still the industry standard.
In an interview with Rotten Tomatoes, the three-time Oscar winner discussed Coppola's professional reemergence after 10 years away from the director's chair, how the tools of the moviemaking trade have changed, and why making movies is like making honey. (Plus, check out an exclusive clip from the movie here.)
What is it about you and Francis Ford Coppola that clicks?
Walter Murch: We clicked right away. We started working together in 1969, which is almost 40 years. I like the way his mind works. I like the adventuresome areas that he goes into. He once described directing as "being the ringmaster for a circus that is inventing itself." That kind of circus is very interesting to me -- being around that -- and by the same token I think he likes the way my mind works in complimentary form to his. I'm adventuresome also but also very systematic. I think the two sides -- adventuresome and systematic -- compliment each other.
Youth Without Youth is a puzzle of a movie. Do you approach a film like this the same way you approach a more linear film?
WM: Yeah, I think so. Every film is a puzzle really, from an editorial point of view. They may look linear when they're finished but our job is to take scattered pieces of story that have been shot more efficiently out of sequence but that sequence is not necessarily given in advance. The script is a guide but how the performances actually turn out, what the weather was like on a particular day, can influence how the film gets constructed. Then I obviously was very aware of the kind of film that Youth Without Youth is. It ventures into territories film doesn't usually go, and I tried to help discover the right cinematic language for that kind of a story. But on a day-to-day basis, fundamentally, it's the same process. You look for the best take, best reading, best shot, to represent what you think is necessary in this sequence and then you put it in the movie and see how it interacts with the shots around it and you make adjustments and go on and find the next shot and so on. When you've got the whole film together you look at it and make evaluations about redundancies. "Is there a scene here that does something we already have? Maybe we can shorten it or remove it altogether." Or, "Maybe we can move it to another location."
RT exclusive image: Tim Roth and Alexandra Maria Lara
What are your hopes for the film?
WM: I hope it finds an audience that's congenial to it. I'm very happy it was made. It got Francis directing again after an absence of 10 years, and now he's going to be shooting another movie.
What are you working on next?
WM: Another project with Francis called Tetro. It's an original screenplay and it starts shooting in Argentina in February.
Do you feel it's unfair for people to compare the current work of someone like Coppola to the stuff he did 30 years ago?
WM: Francis is a special case onto himself because of the success of the films he made in the 1970s. And then he had a period where he got very deeply in debt and had to do films that he otherwise wouldn't have done to dig himself out the financial hole. In that 10-year time, he was writing a number of screenplays, trying to get them off the ground. But he was not happy with the work. But he was working. Francis is a writer/director. Writers in Hollywood can go 10 years without something of theirs being produced. That doesn't mean they're not working, but the process by which a film is selected to be made and turned into a project is a very chancy, quirky operation. Francis has gotten himself into a place where, because of his success with his winery, he can afford, if the budget is low enough, to self-finance these films and get them off the ground.
RT exclusive image: Tim Roth in Youth Without Youth
When did you start to work on this? Once principle photography was done?
WM: In this case, yes. Generally, I would start before photography and be there as the film was being shot, but in this case I was still working on Sam Mendes' Jarhead, so I didn't join the film until all the material was shot although I did meet with Francis at a kind of a midway point. He took a break from shooting in Romania and he came for Christmas to the States. We met to talk about the screenplay and he said, "Are there any other scenes we could shoot? Because we still have a month of shooting left." [Spoiler Alert] And I suggested the scene at the end of the movie where Dominic [played by Tim Roth] gets into an argument with his double which ultimately results in the smashing of the mirror and the killing -- so to speak -- of the double. It was already an argument there, but I thought, "Let's take it to its conclusion." Once the double is dead, it's really a matter of time before Dominic is dead.
Coppola has said this is a personal film for him. Obviously, there's the struggle of the writer tying to finish his masterwork, but why else do you think this film is personal for him?
WM: Francis is 68 and this character is 70. It's been 10 years since Francis directed a movie, and the process of going back into directing I think for him was an invigorating one and one he welcomed, in terms of his own personality but also the young people he found in Romania with whom he collaborated for the film was a very healthy and enriching thing for him. And in a way, that's like being struck by a lightning bolt and rediscovering your youth, except you're also still close to 70 years old. I think that goes back to the title of the film that is also the title of the novel. It's about this person who is youth without youth -- he's young, objectively in his early to late 30s or early 40s but he still has all the knowledge that he had when he was 70 years old. It examines the tension of that situation which really is the tension Francis finds himself in.
You often hear of cinematographers who fight with directors about how things should be shot. What sort of stamp can editors make on a film?
WM: Creatively speaking, your job is twofold. One of them is to choreograph the initial assembly of the images in an interesting and musical way. Even though you're dealing with visuals, editing film is kind of like making visual music. Which shot you use? When exactly do you cut to the next shot? What shot do you cut to? Who is saying what at any one point of time? Is that line on camera or off camera? All of these are under the control of the editor. The director can always look at it and say, "No, do it this other way," but if you're good in the offset, that doesn't often happen. So you end up establishing the orchestration -- in a word -- of the ideas and the visuals of the film in a very particular way. Just like in regular musical orchestration. How it's orchestrated, how it's performed -- why is one orchestration and performance different than another? [This is] similar to the difference an editor can make. Secondly, once you stand back from the whole and see it, the more editorial part of the process comes into play, which is similar enough to an editing of a piece of text or a book. "Should we really begin with this sentence? Maybe we should begin with this paragraph? Maybe you don't need this part, or you can insert something here to clarify what's actually going on?" You act both as a consultant for the director and as somebody for the director to bounce ideas off -- as a co-creator of the work, at that level. In that mode, I just throw out ideas and implement them and show them to Francis and if he likes them, great. If they spark some other idea, so much the better, and if he doesn't like them, we'll go back to the way it was or find some other solution.
RT exclusive image: Alexandra Maria Lara